Beware of cheap underperforming clones

As of 2022 there are many badly performing clones on the market. V2/3GHz NanoVNA uses parts like ADF4350 and AD8342 which are costly and clones have been cutting costs by using salvaged or reject parts.

See official store and look for V2 Plus4/V2 Plus4 Pro versions only to avoid getting a bad clone. We have stopped selling V2.2 versions since October 2020, so all V2 hardware that are not Plus or Plus4 are not made by us and we can not guarantee performance.

NanoVNA V2 Forum

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Where to buy? 4-inch display, case, battery, SMA

David J Taylor 2020/08/31 08:21

I've searched various places, and checked the group's files & Wiki, but I
can't find an offering which is:

- 3 GHz coverage
- 4-inch display (or larger)
- SMA connectors
- cased
- with battery

Am I missing the approved supplier of this combination? I can seem to get
most except the SMA connector - just N-type appears to be what's on offer.

A pointer would be appreciated....

Thanks,
David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk
Twitter: @gm8arv

aleks07111971 2020/08/31 00:58

https://m.aliexpress.ru/item/4000390703223.html?pid=808_0004_0105&spm=a2g0n.productlist.0.0.5be94ff9BEJEv5

OwO 2020/08/31 16:17

Note: unaffiliated

3.2 inch:
https://www.banggood.com/S-A-A-2-NanoVNA-V2-50kHz-3GHz-3_2-Inch-Large-Screen-3G-Vector-Network-Analyzer-S-A-A-2-NanoVNA-V2-Antenna-Analyzer-Shortwave-HF-VHF-UHF-Measure-Duplexer-Filte-p-1707650.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN

4 inch:
https://www.tindie.com/products/blackmagic/4-nanovna-v274-metal-housing-4000mah-battery/

NanoVNA-F will also have a 3GHz version soon.

David J Taylor 2020/08/31 09:34

From: aleks07111971@yandex.ru

https://m.aliexpress.ru/item/4000390703223.html?pid=808_0004_0105&spm=a2g0n.productlist.0.0.5be94ff9BEJEv5
============================

Thanks, but the only 4-inch S-A-A-2 I see is with N-type connectors.

Cheers,
David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk
Twitter: @gm8arv

David J Taylor 2020/08/31 10:10

From: OwO

Note: unaffiliated

3.2 inch:
https://www.banggood.com/S-A-A-2-NanoVNA-V2-50kHz-3GHz-3_2-Inch-Large-Screen-3G-Vector-Network-Analyzer-S-A-A-2-NanoVNA-V2-Antenna-Analyzer-Shortwave-HF-VHF-UHF-Measure-Duplexer-Filte-p-1707650.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN

4 inch:
https://www.tindie.com/products/blackmagic/4-nanovna-v274-metal-housing-4000mah-battery/

NanoVNA-F will also have a 3GHz version soon.
=====================================================

Thanks, OwO!

I did note the 3.2-inch version, but I'd prefer at least 4, having used the
4.3-inch NanoVNA-F for some time now. I made an enquiry about the Tindie
but it was never answered, which did not inspire confidence, but I've added
myself to the waitlist.

I've been very pleased with the NanoVNA-F, and it doesn't suffer from the
deluge of (incompatible?) firmware updates which have plagued other
variants, but other commercial issues (and the virus) seem to be delaying
things!

Cheers,
David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk
Twitter: @gm8arv

Siegfried Jackstien 2020/08/31 12:27

why not use n sockets?!?

https://de.aliexpress.com/item/1005001267696890.html

dg9bfc sigi

Am 31.08.2020 um 09:10 schrieb David J Taylor via groups.io:

- Show quoted text -
jean-Jacques F6HTG 2020/08/31 06:27

Hello David,
i find mine to Aliexpress, the only way to find it actualy.
i have receive mine today! it is like description on the link down.
it has a batterie inside, the box is metalic, and very good quality cables are fine RG-142-PUR, whith good N connectors, and a good CAL kit.
i ham very happy for that, for a price of 60 Euros!

link: https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005001267696890.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.27ee6c37rRKcs3

73s, Jean-Jacques from France (F6HTG)

David J Taylor 2020/08/31 15:07

From: Siegfried Jackstien
[]
why not use n sockets?!?

https://de.aliexpress.com/item/1005001267696890.html

dg9bfc sigi
==================================

I can appreciate the advantages of using the more robust connector, but
almost everything else here is either SMA or the wretched "UHF" connectors
fitted to some amateur radio gear (e.g. filters and combiners).

That particular item has quite a low price (attractive) but is it a rip-off
clone, or am I supporting the original developer(s)?

As time goes on the more I'm tempted to wait for the 3 GHz NanoVNA-F!

73,
David GM8ARV
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk
Twitter: @gm8arv

David J Taylor 2020/08/31 15:10

From: jean-Jacques F6HTG

Hello David,
i find mine to Aliexpress, the only way to find it actualy.
i have receive mine today! it is like description on the link down.
it has a batterie inside, the box is metalic, and very good quality cables
are fine RG-142-PUR, whith good N connectors, and a good CAL kit.
i ham very happy for that, for a price of 60 Euros!

link:
https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005001267696890.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.27ee6c37rRKcs3

73s, Jean-Jacques from France (F6HTG)
================================================

Merci.

I will be interested to hear how you get on with that device - it now has
two recommendations!

73,
David GM8ARV
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk
Twitter: @gm8arv

Hector Pascal 2020/09/01 08:35

Hi guys,
FWIW There's one further additional comment in the Zeenco Aliexpress ad
(translated from Polish):
"...only the N sockets are installed a bit crookedly." Hmmm... poor
attention to detail is NOT promising!
But the 4* one that really made me pause at buying it says: "But the
installed firmware shows only 900 MHz ;( Need an update for 3 GHz."
As a general rule, I'm not too keen to do immediate firmware updates on
equipment that I expect to work as advertised "out of the box".
Hector.

On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 10:12 PM David J Taylor via groups.io <david-taylor=
blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

- Show quoted text -
John Gord 2020/08/31 18:18

Hector,
The default frequency range at startup is usually 100MHz to 900MHz. Selecting "Stimulus", then "Stop" lets you set a frequency as high as 4.4GHz. The specifications are only guaranteed up to 3GHz. No firmware update is needed for the higher frequency.
--John Gord

On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 05:47 PM, Hector Pascal wrote:

- Show quoted text -
Hector Pascal 2020/08/31 18:34

Thanks John, for confirming that. I DID wonder if it was some sort of misunderstanding by the buyer! And I'm not too worried about the likelihood of "crooked connectors".
I will probably go ahead and buy it very soon.
Hector

Hugo 2020/08/31 20:13

For a product that had to be tested before leaving, it is special that the incorrect installation of the connectors was not detected ...
And why not have installed the latest firmware? Private from Zeenco.

I'm waiting for mine and it scares me a little that any release of quality will reduce the product ...

Hugo 2020/08/31 20:20

I just noticed that the 2 reviews on Aliexpress with photos that the connectors are crooked even though one of them says the quality best good ... Zeenco will have to do a better check of quality...

Hector Pascal 2020/08/31 21:23

I think close up camera lens distortion is making it look MUCH worse than it probably is. Note that the triangular side " cheeks" appear also bent outwards.
- Hector.

Hugo 2020/09/01 00:27

Indeed, there is surely a little distortion in the lens which worsens the actual condition, especially in one of the 2 cases .... I am impatiently awaiting mine to confirm the condition.

jean-Jacques F6HTG 2020/09/01 05:05

Hi all,
Mine whitout replacing the firmware, is running from 50 KHz to 3GHZ, and fine,
so no need to flash, the FW, but, there is a new version of FW, i will try sooner,
but, actualy it working well!

73's,
Jean-Jacques F6HTG

Stephen Laurence 2020/09/02 05:28

My “ official” SaAA2N with n connectors arrived today, got from a recommended Alibaba seller.

What a fantastic piece of kit. My 2.8” v2 is out on semi-permanent loan, my 3.2” v2 is very nice, but this 4” one with n connectors looks so much more robust and easier to read. I feel I can take this one outside, although it definitely is not waterproof. It seems to perform a bit better than the 3.2” one, too, although I am away from home and cannot do too much with it. I do have my own n cal standards with me which seem to be as good as the included ones.

When I get home, it will probably be semipermanently fitted with (sacrificial) n to sma converters,

Go for this one, unless you want to wait for the next improved spec model, but you could be doing that firever.

When I get home I will send a picture of all three alongside each other.

Steve L

David J Taylor 2020/09/02 14:32

My “ official” SaAA2N with n connectors arrived today, got from a
recommended Alibaba seller.

What a fantastic piece of kit. My 2.8” v2 is out on semi-permanent loan, my
3.2” v2 is very nice, but this 4” one with n connectors looks so much more
robust and easier to read. I feel I can take this one outside, although it
definitely is not waterproof. It seems to perform a bit better than the 3.2”
one, too, although I am away from home and cannot do too much with it. I do
have my own n cal standards with me which seem to be as good as the included
ones.

When I get home, it will probably be semipermanently fitted with
(sacrificial) n to sma converters,

Go for this one, unless you want to wait for the next improved spec model,
but you could be doing that firever.

When I get home I will send a picture of all three alongside each other.

Steve L
==================================

Thanks, Steve. I'm gradually coming round towards the "N" version, with
N-SMA adapters. But as it's not urgent, the "improved" spec. is tempting.
Remembering the Osborne portable PC - as soon as the new one was hinted
sales of the current model fell through the floor!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect

Cheers,
David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk
Twitter: @gm8arv

Siegfried Jackstien 2020/09/04 14:27

hi steve

today also mine came in :-)

yes its a superb device ... only thing that makes me fear a bit is ...
what does happen if the lipo cell blows up?? (it will sure crack the
display or pcb) ... why dont they make the case even bigger and add 2x
18650 lipo cells instead?!?

yes i know ... COSTS ... but i got it for such a low price i would pay
10 or 20 more for a unit with "safer" cells inside

what do others think?!?

greetz sigi dg9bfc

Am 02.09.2020 um 12:28 schrieb Stephen Laurence:

- Show quoted text -
Siegfried Jackstien 2020/09/04 14:30

hi david

THREE :-)

i also got mine today and its a realy good device

but ... you will find 200 shops where you can buy the saa2n ... price
range from 60 to 80 eu (roughly)

quality is good ... and it works superb

greetz sigi dg9bfc

Am 31.08.2020 um 14:10 schrieb David J Taylor via groups.io:

- Show quoted text -
John Cunliffe W7ZQ ( 2020/09/05 07:23

What happens? Hmmm you either replace the cell before it happens with something different of you buy a new device. After all, it cost less than a steak dinner.

Isidro Berniol 2020/09/05 22:38

Hi,

don't mind about the LiPo cell. You will find out fast if it blows :-)

If you like you can replace the cell with something bigger. I will do so
because of longer runtime.

You can add some 18650 cells.

Regards,

Isidro

DB1SBI


Am 04.09.2020 um 16:27 schrieb Siegfried Jackstien:

- Show quoted text -
Mike Willis 2020/09/06 00:35

That latter one is a clever combination of a standard Hammond case with a 3D printed front panel. Therefore seems ideal for those of us thinking of making up ourselves as an upgrade to our standard versions. That is, if the parts can be obtained. So, can they? The 4" screen is the tricky one.

Mike

aleks07111971 2020/09/06 00:38

what is the difficulty?

Siegfried Jackstien 2020/09/06 12:37

i will modify one of my units with 18650 cells ... the older one
(without case and sma sockets) will sure get those cells inside ...

but in the new saa2n (version with big screen, n socket and metal case)
there is no room left for 18650 cell(s) .. so there i have to keep the
flatpack ... to add some safety i could change it after a year or two
... but when i find out it blows up ... it sure is toooo late :-(

greetz sigi dg9bfc

Am 05.09.2020 um 20:38 schrieb Isidro Berniol:

- Show quoted text -
Stephen Laurence 2020/09/06 23:59

What is the problem with the flat cells?

Over the years, I have only had one problem with them and that was IN an Iphone3 where it had swelled up and cracked the screen. I actually bought it in that state as I was hoping I could use the board ( it was a vary large memory one, but the board had been bent as well.

For the cost you could just buy another one if the unlikely event occurred. The reduced demand for a bigger case to put 18650 cells in (inefficient space wise and still could blow up) means they are a lot more expensive.

I am very impressed with my V2N. The only problem has been with the standards. I think the problem is the shoulder of the male pin which is a couple of thousanths too high as it presses axially into the standard when the ring is tightened finger tight.

Steve L. G7PSZ

Siegfried Jackstien 2020/09/07 18:21

the open standard should have a pin inside like short and load ...
otherwise lenght is a bit wrong ...

... is the male pin to long ... or is it the female inside the device??
(here load works well but i never tighten those connectors very hard)

dg9bfc sigi


Am 07.09.2020 um 06:59 schrieb Stephen Laurence:

- Show quoted text -
Kurt Poulsen 2020/09/08 00:20

Hi Sigi
First of all the calibration kit items for the SAA-2N as well the test cables are just super.
My comment to your comment:
No the open is just perfect. Male short and open calibration standards are actually clones of HP85032B/E calibration standard and the male open is using the SAA-2N non terminated center conductor of the female adaptor as the open calibration element. However the N female adaptor center conductor on the SAA-2N is a bit longer with respect to the calibration plane as the HP85032B/E is designed for, so a correction of -0.3ps is required but that will be include in my data for the calibration kit to be published.
I am right now characterizing the SAA-2N calibration standards and will shortly publish s1p calibration files for various frequency spans for the VNA-QT software and the coefficients for the NanoVNA-saver.
My documentation will be for both a male and female calibration kit using the FF adaptor to create female SOL. The FF thru adaptor will also be characterized with a s2p file for thru calibration so both forward and reverse transmission can be measured by reverting the DUT for S12 and S22 measurements. The MM test cable is of so high quality that is can be used to fine tune the calibration and compensate for variations in the load as these are with certain spread. The male short and open will not deviate from item to item. I will demonstrate in my documentation how to do that.
So hang on, it is a complex task with very many measurements and data processing so I have a few days work left
Kind regards
Kurt

Siegfried Jackstien 2020/09/09 10:40

hi kurt

would not an n plug with inside tip but no cable added better represent
the right length? ... now the open assumes the ref plane to be the n
socket end (cause inside tip ends there) but the load and the short have
their reference plane more far out (load and short have them inside the
cal kit plug)

i made a fast sketch (no its not good but you will see what i mean)

in my understanding the open should be also have the pin inside (that
should end at same length as the load and short have their contacting to
the shield)

yes ... cables are good ... and load also shows superb values (no idea
what they made inside but its really really good) ... but the open in my
understanding should have the pin ... not??? ... maybe it is splitting
hairs ... maybe not ... but to have the ref plane all at the same length
a pin should be added to the open ... when i read your text you also
know that the ref plane is the n female pin for the open (while its a
bit longer for load and short) ...

when you do your testings ... maybe try to use a male connector instead
the open in the cal kit (or a double male cause thats a bit longer??)

for my kc901 i did exactly do it that way ... used a well known load
(found on a flew market) ... and "homebrewed" short and open from two n
male connectors ... maybe they are not perfect ... but it was the best i
had :-)

what do you think??

greetz sigi dg9bfc

Am 07.09.2020 um 22:20 schrieb Kurt Poulsen:

- Show quoted text -
reference.jpg
ok1vaw 2020/09/09 04:00

I suppose that the open with central pin has a fringe capacitance, so more or less it has to be compensated too, if the pin length is the same lneght as in short.

Kurt Poulsen 2020/09/09 14:27

Hi Sigfried

I am afraid you have no understood where the calibration plane is positioned and what it mean for a calibration.

The N calibration plane is for the male at the end of the circular screen surrounding the male center conduction which is mating the female N at the bottom of the outer diameter surrounding the female center conductor. It is not at the tip of the female center conductor as you suggest. For a calibration standard it is important that the mechanical structure is as simple as possible and the SAA-2N male short is an good example where the delay is determined by the distance from the tip of screening cylinder to the shorting disk and being an airline with no Teflon which would add a shunt C which at higher frequency would be dominating. As it is now it is a short inductor having a fairly linear impedance over the frequency range in question. The same way the open standard is just circular hole which together with the female center conductor act as a capacitor and the delay determined by the distance from the female reference plane to the tip of the female center conductor with some further fringe capacitance from the tip of the female center conductor also called end point radiation. For both the male and female calibration standard we can assume the Z0 is 50 ohm and as we a dealing with air as the dielectric the velocity factor is 1 and delay is distance in mm divided by 0.3 (speed of light)
Any addition of extra parts such as a male adaptor with center pin for an open standard is not a good idea as it makes the calibration poorer and requires a more complex characterization

For the load we must expect it is not pure 50 ohm but have some inductive or capacitive elements as well but is does not matter if all the loads supplied with the SAA-2N are identical or deviate slightly.

My job is to create some s1p files which fully represent the SAA-2N calibration kit parts. That is done by calibration the SAA-2N with my professional HP85032B calibration kit and the measure the SAA-2N short open and load and save the result as s1p file used for calibration of the VNA-QT software. Is so to speak create a cloning of my HP85032B calibration kit. I also create the L and C coefficients for NanoVNA-saver.
That is just some of the thing to expect published in few days.

I hope this is a help to understand what calibration is all about.

OF course you may invent you own methods and declare you own reference plane position, but then you are totally on you own 😊

Kind regards

Kurt

Kurt Poulsen 2020/09/09 15:28

Hi Sigfried
One more comment
When calibrating the SAA-2N as standalone it assumes short open and load are ideal. For frequencies up to 500MHz the open offset delay is 20.5ps, for the short the offset delay is 19.8ps in the HF range and 19.5ps in the VHF range, meaning in average 20ps for both. By 500MHz the load resistance drop by 0.2ohm and is 0.5ohm inductive. By 3000MHz load increase by 3ohm and being 2 ohm inductive so still small changes. The return loss a 3000MHz 30dB.
That mean in real life the measurement plane is shifted by in average 20ps equal to 6mm forward in relationship to the calibration plane which does not have much impact on any measurement of antennas and filters
Kind regards
Kurt

Siegfried Jackstien 2020/09/09 17:20

hmmm ... yes ... you never can be perfect (the short also has "some"
inductance) ... but you can get very close ... guessing a "too short"
central gives a higher fault in calculated length as the fringe
capacitance of the open with pin influeces your data

when you calculate (measure) the length ... you should have same data
for open and short ... but a shorter inner connector electrically
shortens the measured cable length cause the reflection is then at the
socket but for the load and short its not

i did not measure that (something for kurt to be done) but on my kc901 i
used a male plug with a short and another male plug with nothing but the
pin ... and the results where good (more or less exact same length)

and at the end ... we can never assue same performance as 100k test gear
from a 60 bucks unit :-) ... for what we have its a superb device


Am 09.09.2020 um 11:00 schrie that b ok1vaw:

- Show quoted text -
Siegfried Jackstien 2020/09/09 17:45

i am afraid i fully understand it :-)

reference plane is the length where load and short is (and where open
end has its tip end!!)

yes i know ... if the connector inside has any diameter bumps etc then
its more difficult to be exact ... but having the n sockets tip end as
end of open for calibration ... and having load and short be longer ...
would give a higher fault i think (see my sketch)

the male connector WITH pin inside should show better results as when
you let the tip away (false length on the open)

the male connector should be perfect 50 ohms and the length of the pin
should be that its exactly mating with the female socket (no diameter bumps)

maybe it is splitting hairs ... but i do know that the lenght of the
open and the short and the load ... should be the same ... NOT?!?

greetz sigi dg9bfc


Am 09.09.2020 um 12:27 schrieb Kurt Poulsen:

- Show quoted text -
reference_b.jpg
Kurt Poulsen 2020/09/09 20:35

Hi Sigfried

I am afraid you did not understand 😊
At least I do not understand what you are trying to explain as you also take a cable into consideration .

I did some years ago write a document which both show a similar calibration kit as the one provided with the SAA-2N and a method how to fabricate one yourself.
I is a very technical document and which will blow you away, but I has some pictures about where the calibration planes are positioned which can guide you

http://www.hamcom.dk/VNWA/How to fabricate a N Male and Female calibration kit rev2.pdf <http://www.hamcom.dk/VNWA/How%20to%20fabricate%20a%20N%20Male%20and%20Female%20calibration%20kit%20rev2.pdf>

Have fun being confused

Kind regards

Kurt

Stephen Laurence 2020/09/10 01:36

For anyone interested.....

I bought three of the Radiall 50 ohm terminators mentioned in Kurt’s treatise on making N calibration standards.

Price for THREE was... less than £10 (£12 with postage, £4 each!). According to the Radiall site they are specified as 50 ohm terminators but 70 ohm impedance. On the basis that the centre male pin would be slightly smaller diameter and NOT damage my V2N recepticle I bought them. I have not got the tools to measure centre pin diameter but they look the same diameter as 50 ohm ones.

They measured very close to 50 ohm and I could not see anything but a green dot on the correct place on the Smith chart.

Grab them while there are some left. Search “ Radiall terminator 50 ohm” on Ebay.

Steve L. G7PSZ

The seller is still selling them

biastee 2020/09/14 19:55

Kurt did a good job explaining the reference plane's positions in the N standards. However, for those who have a problem visualizing Kurt's textual explanation, I recommend looking at fig. 4 of this Maury document: https://www.maurymw.com/pdf/datasheets/5A-021.pdf ...a picture speaks a thousand words

Obliquely related to this topic, fig 5 of the aforementioned link shows the reference planes for the SMA connector. In a nutshell, SMA's reference planes defined in different positions from the N - therein, lies the confusion.
73, Chin-leong, 9W2LC

Kurt Poulsen 2020/09/15 11:08

Hi Gent

I did 10 years ago a document on the subject where there are pictures of SMA. N and BNC with respect to reference planes. As said pictures says a 1000 word.

The document is quite educational in general as still up to day so to speak. Please disregard all the comment on calibration to center of thru, it has since then changed to a method where the full delay of the thru is subtracted in the calibration process. The VNWA has evolved quite a lot during these 10 years passed, but the first many pages in the document gives a good understanding of what reference plane and delays are all about. In the NanoVNA-Saver we are dealing with one way delay which is called offset delay which also is used for e.g. HP calibration kit. For the VNWA the short and open delay define is a two way delay – twice the offset delay – because we are dealing with a reflection so the signal is traveling forth and back and thus a true physical delay. In the thru calibration it is a one way delay as being a travel thru the adaptor and not a reflection, as for the short and open. Extension port delay is thus a one way delay even when examining a reflection measurement …confused 😊
To confuse you further there is a reflection from the RX port when we are dealing with S21 transmission (one way delay) but that is a another story to tell 😊

http://www.hamcom.dk/VNWA/How to measure on SOL calibration kits_REV1.pdf <http://www.hamcom.dk/VNWA/How%20to%20measure%20on%20SOL%20calibration%20kits_REV1.pdf>

Kind regards

Kurt

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