Hi, has anyone used the Nano VNA (any model) as part of an antenna measurement system? Like the picture below.
If you have, can you recommend a position control system?
Is there an amplification system that would work with the VNA-6000b frequency range (50 KHz - 6 GHz)?
Thanks,
David
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Nano VNA for Antenna Measurements
EMCO markets a number of professional positioning systems, both turntables
and vertical masts. Don't know if they have been bought out by someone,
but I'm sure if you search on EMCO, you'll find them.
Dave - WØLEV
On Mon, Aug 26, 2024 at 9:59 AM Dave via groups.io <david.matthew.daniel=
gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
> Hi, has anyone used the Nano VNA (any model) as part of an antenna
> measurement system? Like the picture below.
>
>
> If you have, can you recommend a position control system?
> Is there an amplification system that would work with the VNA-6000b
> frequency range (50 KHz - 6 GHz)?
>
> Thanks,
> David
>
>
>
--
*Dave - WØLEV*
How about a Minicircuits ZX60-6013E-S+
3.3 dB NF, 12-16 dB gain
20 MHz to 6 GHz
https://minicircuits.com/WebStore/dashboard.html?model=ZX60-6013E-S%2B
Any common amateur radio application for rotators can supply you with the heading data.
I assume you are trying to do a near-field plot?
Joseph D. Yuna
Joseph D. Yuna (LCDR USN/ret.)
1006 River Hills Rd.
Beavercreek, OH 45430-1124
United States of America
Primary: +617.943.2635
<mailto:W4JDY1953@gmail.com> W4JDY1953@gmail.com
This should bring the output power of the test port on the VNA 6000b from -10 dBm to around 0 or +2 dBm, good. Maybe two of these could be cascaded to increase the gain, have you tried that with these types of amplifiers?
I found three different companies with EMCO that have made products for antenna measurements at one time,
https://www.emco-elektronik.de/en/
https://www.atecorp.com/products/ets-lindgren-emco
http://www.emcoelectronics.org/index.html
I found this 2-axis field probe positioner
https://www.atecorp.com/products/innco-systems/fsm2315
I found something like this:
Yes this is for a near field antenna measurement, how did you guess?
OR you can get some
eBay item number: 335308105686
for about 5 bucks each nd get 4 of them....at least one will work...
Don
From: "Jim Lux" <jimlux@earthlink.net>
To: NanoVNAV2@groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 26, 2024 1:50:04 PM
Subject: Re: [nanovnav2] Nano VNA for Antenna Measurements
How about a Minicircuits ZX60-6013E-S+
3.3 dB NF, 12-16 dB gain
20 MHz to 6 GHz
[ https://minicircuits.com/WebStore/dashboard.html?model=ZX60-6013E-S%2B | https://minicircuits.com/WebStore/dashboard.html?model=ZX60-6013E-S%2B ]
--
------------
Don Latham
PO Box 404,
Frenchtown, MT, 59846
406-626-4304
If you’re looking for just a programmable turntable, I’d look at some of the
hobby robotics companies.
There are solutions at all price points. In the “several hundred dollar”
range there’s lots of things used for automated welding tables and such. In
the sub $100 range, it’s more RC vehicle sort of stuff:
[![2DOF-Electric-Rotatable-Rotary-Robot-Arm-Base-Platform-Aluminium-Alloy-
with-20KG-25KG-Metal-Digital-
Servo.jpg](cid:44E2FD80-7994-4263-B859-FA20FCAFF56A)
---
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I’d avoid a “antenna rotator” because they often have bang/bang controllers
and poor precision accuracy - If you’re pointing a Yagi with 20 degree
beamwidth, a few degrees isn’t an issue.
You might see what UCLA has done in their antenna labs (they’ve done a lot of
“small antenna ranges” work at 2.45 GHz and up).
Any one of a number of “motion control” companies can set you up with a
controller and motor/gearbox/encoder system, but that will be closer to $1000
by the time you’re done (although the inexpensive imported versions will be
cheaper).
Consider also that you may need to power down the drive while making a
measurement, since PWM drives generate copious RFI.
> On Aug 27, 2024, at 8:59 AM, Dave <david.matthew.daniel@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> I found three different companies with EMCO that have made products for
antenna measurements at one time,
>
>
>
> <https://www.emco-elektronik.de/en/>
>
> <https://www.atecorp.com/products/ets-lindgren-emco>
>
> <http://www.emcoelectronics.org/index.html>
>
>
>
> I found this 2-axis field probe positioner
>
> <https://www.atecorp.com/products/innco-systems/fsm2315>
>
>
>
> <inline.0.part>
_._,_._,_
* * *
How heavy is your AUT (or probe, if you’re doing NF in polar scan)? That
might be overkill. And as mentioned in my other response, rotators for tower
mounted antennas often have poor repeatability and precision. 5 degrees is
doing well.
> On Aug 27, 2024, at 8:59 AM, Dave <david.matthew.daniel@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> I found something like this:
>
>
>
> <Screenshot_20240827-095123.png>
>
>
>
> Yes this is for a near field antenna measurement, how did you guess?
_._,_._,_
* * *
Normally, you’d put it on Port 2, to boost the signal coming from the probe.
If you amplify the Port 1 signal, you don’t get the S11 of the AUT (if probe
is Port 2 and AUT is Port 1).
I’ll note that sometimes you want S11 of the probe, because then you can
calibrate out the cable effects as it bends and moves. You look for the
impedance discontinuity in a sweep, and use that to back out the cable
contribution. There’s a bunch of papers from places like Nearfield Systems
Inc (and before that Scientific Atlanta) that describe how it’s done.
Important if you’re doing near field because you’re sensitive to the phase of
the measurement when it goes into the FFT processing to turn near field into
far field patterns.
Yes, they are cascadable, and Minicircuits has dozens of similar amplifiers
with different gain and 1dB compression points. Considering that the NanoVNA
isn’t sinusoidal and depends on using harmonics, compressing the amplifier may
not be an issue, the extra harmonics are fine, and maybe even desirable.
You’ll calibrate with the amplifier in the system, of course.
> On Aug 27, 2024, at 8:59 AM, Dave <david.matthew.daniel@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> This should bring the output power of the test port on the VNA 6000b from
-10 dBm to around 0 or +2 dBm, good. Maybe two of these could be cascaded to
increase the gain, have you tried that with these types of amplifiers?
_._,_._,_
* * *
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